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30/05/11 06:25pm
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Hey guys, drag0n here getting the details in early CGa: 7:00pm AEDT 31/5/11 Apotheosis Vs. masqueRade on infernohttp://www.cybergamer.com.au/matchdetails/130743/hltv - hltv.cybergamer.com.au:22023 CGp: Pending reschedule still 8:00pm AEDT 31/5/11 bestnless Vs. ArchaicMSI Esports: Team 2 on tuscanhttp://www.cybergamer.com.au/matchdetails/132047/hltv - hltv.cybergamer.com.au:22022 9:30pm AEDT 31/5/11 NORDLAND Vs. ArchaicMSI Esports: Team 1 on tuscanhttp://www.cybergamer.com.au/matchdetails/132045/hltv - hltv.cybergamer.com.au:22023 9:30pm AEDT 31/5/11 Athletico Vs. Mindfreak.RAZER on tuscanhttp://www.cybergamer.com.au/matchdetails/132048/hltv - hltv.cybergamer.com.au:22021 Good luck to everyone playing A few matters of upkeeping...In Green League, teams might notice they have lost rounds and their positions on the ladder may have changed. This is because of the rather late removal of all games played by the two removed teams FIGJAM and One Fuzion. We haven't been scheduleding their games since they left and it creates an unfair ladder if the teams that played against them were to keep their results. Appologies for the lateness of this change, it may come as a rude awakening to a couple of teams looking to get into finals. Another matter is the recommission of Andyz0r's BOT. We have brought it back in order to keep the league more sustainable and easier for us admins, which in turn should provide a more enjoyable gaming experience for you guys. Some of you have been complaining about the servers and 'lag' produced by the BOT. We are aware of this, it is actually only produced when the match is in the waiting for !ready stage (The menu on the screen which displays who is ready may lag some people). Once everyone's ready, the screen goes away and you shouldn't have any problems. The bot also handles the choosing of teams from the knife round. Simply type !t or !team and a menu will appear with CT, T or Random. This system works on majority. For example, if two people on a team pick CT and three pick T then that team will start off on T side first. If there is an equal number of votes, it goes to Random. Once 30 seconds has past or everyone on the winning team has voted the menu will deactivate and teams will no longer be able to select an option, (there's no point keeping the menu open). The BOT also stops (hopefully) mwheel bopping like it did previously and auto-records the POVs. Hopefully I didn't forget anything. A massive thankyou for Andy's time and effort in getting the bot back up and ready for us. His efforts have secured us another season of the CG ladder. If you have any questions, queries or ideas on how we can improve our system, please direct those question to me (Drag0n). Thank you
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30/05/11 06:50pm
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I think i can speak for everyone when i say its ridiculous to reintroduce the bot right before the finals. I for one experienced many problems with the bot and im fairly sure it will happen again. I think its stupid and i request that the bot be held off until atleast next season or until the appropriate changes are made.
P.S I appreciate the hard work andy did on this bot but i think the preventing of the mousewheel is impractical as people who bop legally cant do it anymore and it just affects the gameplay
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30/05/11 06:56pm
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"appropriate changes" please explain.
The only problem people have is that they don't read what is said and become confused, The bot stays it a lot easier for admins and ref's alike to run these games.
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30/05/11 06:57pm
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Im just speaking from past experience so perhaps i should of waited until i used it again before making my post. But i had some real issues with the anti mwheelbop, because i bop legally using ctrl but if i tap it too fast then i completely stop altogether, so im not sure if thats a problem only i experienced or if its been worked on, but i could not bop ingame with andy's bot.
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30/05/11 07:15pm
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dreamr must be trolling, he doesn't even play cg?
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30/05/11 08:37pm
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with all due respect, i totally disagree 100% with the statement about the 'lag' only being during warmup.
If there is anything we can do to stop the re-introduction of the bot, i'm more than willing to do it.
The bot is not suitable for Australian Online CS in it's current state (current as in when it was last implemented).
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30/05/11 09:12pm
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I agree with gomez 100% that the lag was during the entire game, not just during warmup, for the first week of play when the bot was in place. Performance was noticeably improved in the later weeks when it was removed.
I'm not sure what (if anything) has changed since the last bot but if its the same as it used to be then the lag is definitely not just when the menu is up.
If its been drastically changed/updated then I guess we'll have to see, but from what i heard from the ALPHA guys the server was worse than in previous weeks.
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30/05/11 09:42pm
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the bot doesnt only stop you when you bop to much it freezes you completly at some point, i cant remember what exactly it was but i was pointing out 2 andyz0r
I dont think its a good idea at all to re-introduce it before the finals
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30/05/11 09:46pm
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the server we played in had moments of awfulness, but I only have one bone to pick with the bot overall.
You say that the bot you have re-installed stops people from mousewheel bopping, but what you don't realise is that it stops people from crouch bopping altogether. Sometimes you can bop, othertimes it glitches and doesn't let you do anything. I really don't understand what the problem is with bopping and why everyone feels the need to do things to stop it from occurring. It has become part of the game, you guys really need to learn to accept it.
edit: Incase you didn't realise, I am in ALPHA, and am using last nights semi-final match against 1UP as a preface for my above comments.
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30/05/11 09:54pm
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#6
If you want to complain you should provide an alternative, That keeps the rules in place
Allows admins not to be there, records all logs (chat/ip/etc), and makes everyone record a pov (auto),With no funding at all, completely free.
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30/05/11 09:57pm
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jakr I think that the bot is pretty cool man, and I agree that it helps with almost no rebuttal in ensuring that its a quick & easy match with all the minor details outside of the result itself being taken care of (such as POV demo, ips of each player), however it can be very frustrating when you've built a muscle memory on how to pick certain lines and all of a sudden you freeze in mid air and end up looking somewhere you never intended to, or even worse; being somewhere you never originally intended.
edit: is it possible at all to keep all other aspects of the bot aside from the bopping thing?? if you need help PM me what language the bot is coded in and i'll see what i can do, free of charge.
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30/05/11 10:24pm
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#10 I know the bot is great in theory and has a lot of important functionality, but if it makes it a worse playing experience for the people involved and lowers the quality of the competition then it should really be questioned if its worth using or not - especially right before finals are starting, and seeing as the season has ran pretty well for the ~6-7 weeks without the bot.
But again im not sure whats changed in terms of performance since the first week when it was used - but if nothing has changed then it 100% shouldnt be used.
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30/05/11 10:53pm
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been laggy during my games yesterday. not sure if it has something to do with the bot. my teammates didn't seem to have issues. looks like just melb players have this experience?
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30/05/11 11:04pm
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30/05/11 11:45pm
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whilst i appreciate the admins work, i don't see what the massive problem was through the whole season when we weren't using the bot?
A bot to change teams, really?
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31/05/11 12:06am
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The issue is the fact that us admins have to sit around for hours waiting on you guys... It's a bit taxing. Hence why the bot is in Mojo...
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31/05/11 12:23am
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stop crying like fucking bitches
STFU and PLAY
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31/05/11 01:59am
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if the problem is getting people to babysit the matches, i'll happily sit in ANY match and admin it.
I dont understand what has changed in the last 6 weeks.
IF anything, once the bot was removed, the CG ran smoother.
And as for jakr
"If you want to complain you should provide an alternative, That keeps the rules in place
Allows admins not to be there, records all logs (chat/ip/etc), and makes everyone record a pov (auto),With no funding at all, completely free."
Well for starters, for Server Log itself (yes it's part of CS and it's free - records the logs, IP's Steamids)
so we are left with "forcing POV and Mousebobbing"
which didn't seem to be a problem for the last 6 weeks. Not to mention the MouseBob fix also fucks up basic cs movements like trying to go down a vent fast, or doing the NEO catwalk bob to get to reverse rafter fast.
Also, "with all due respect, i totally disagree 100% with the statement about the 'lag' only being during warmup."
Does that really sound like i'm complaining ??
I just stating the bot was far too "cute" which impacted the server.
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31/05/11 02:22am
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With more admins now than the past few weeks it should be easier not harder to always have someone in the matches, and like gomez has said he can help out and im sure there are others (theres only 1 week of matches left anyway + finals).
While having the bot is a convenience for the admins i wont deny, it should be nothing more than that and not relied on as a necessity.
The bot was removed after the first week for good reason, it made the server/rego noticeably worse and makes for a poorer competition when all players in the server are struggling to get frags, and unless anythings drastically changed i personally dont agree with it being re-used.
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31/05/11 03:10am
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the bot made the server noticeably worse in last nights games, and basic movement seemed extremely difficult at times as listed above.
sure the bots handy but it really cant be that hard to admin a game - ppl have been doing it for years this way.
CG is run for the community / players why not make the game more enjoyable for them and the spectators.
my 2c
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31/05/11 07:34am
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I understand that it makes it alot easier on you admins because obviously you dont have to be there. But to make such a drastic change (which it causes) to the tournament in the last cpl weeks is not impressing :(
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31/05/11 07:38am
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Ill also put my hand up to admin games, this isnt a troll post, but for the benefit of the competition ill admin games in the final few weeks provided that it doesnt clash with my basketball schedule (tuesdays and wednesdays only)
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31/05/11 07:51am
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#13 no it was pretty laggy for us in sydney too. dont see why a bot is really necessary. if everyone just records pov then should solve most problems anyways. if you have an issue with the other team it should be on you to spend your time watching their demo and provide evidence.
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31/05/11 10:17am
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our servers are dogshit to begin with and almost unplayable, dont put amx or any bot crap to make it more laggier, get an admin in each game every game.. its not fucken hard cunts are just so lazy its a joke.
40 ping and u wanna play with even more lag ? anything over 10 isnt proper CS
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31/05/11 10:18am
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if youve been playing for 3 yrs + and you cant tell if someones cheating from a pov head back to pub aswell
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31/05/11 10:31am
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I can be an ingame admin on tuesdays if u still need more admins (if thats the problem) :-)
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31/05/11 10:45am
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31/05/11 11:48am
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who are the admins right now for each division ?
who does invite/main/ama ? separate them, is 4 enough for each division to have an admin present every game ? why hasnt anyone bought a decent server or put in for a data centre ? How did i get better ping and rego 6 years ago on a worse connection than now ? Why do we use 2 sites to run 1 online league through ?
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31/05/11 12:08pm
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31/05/11 01:45pm
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mOiLez askin the tough questions
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31/05/11 01:47pm
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look look, while he stands tough notice that this man did not have his hands up
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31/05/11 02:03pm
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I am white
I am a fuckin bum
I do live in a trailer with my mom
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31/05/11 02:18pm
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In all honesty I don't like the "Bop stopper" either. I have talked to Andy previously about getting it removed but he is absolutely swamped at the moment unfortunately.
He has some spare time coming up in the next couple of days so we will see what we can do about getting it taken out.
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31/05/11 02:31pm
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if you dont like the bop stopper yourself then theres no positives to using that bot at all... You're basically saying because it helps out the admin you dont give a shit about the 10 players who actually are playing and not sitting in spec typing rcon exec lo3.cfg - How lazy can you get lol... but dw aslong as it makes your amazingly difficult job alot easier its all good. Imagine if people wernt spastic.
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31/05/11 02:38pm
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In the long run the bot will replace admins to be needed to ref games for CG similar to the source war-bot. It does the things we need, Auto uploads HLTV checks rates / scripts
amongst other things.
I will agree that the bop stopper is not correct yet But everything else is fine.
If anyone wants to put in with myself and a few others for a AussieHQ box then by all means yet me know your intentions.
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31/05/11 02:59pm
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Ted, you realize that I play the league too and share all the interests of the players? Thank you for your insightful post anyway.
The bop stopper is not the whole bot. The bot as Jakr said is there to make the league more sustainable.
Source runs something like 72 teams with a bot, no complaints, no issues. We are trying to setup a system that works for 1.6. Admins sitting in games will probably never be reliable and the league would not have continued the way it was being run previously.
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31/05/11 03:03pm
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I think the real question in this thread is does teddyt have a friend named chedderbob who shoots himself in his leg, with his own gun?
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31/05/11 03:05pm
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#35 what fps would the servers on the box be running ?
Bop stopper was fine when I played, could do all the movement things fine. If your having troubles your obviously trying to exploit the movement system.
The only issue I had was the level of activity of the bot when it was live, but the admins seemed to wash those fears away.
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31/05/11 03:08pm
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Despite sponny most likely being trolling somehow, i agree. I use control to bop and i could still bop fine. The bot did make the server laggier though. The only real solution is to remove every form of AMX completely off all servers and admin them the old fashioned way. People in this thread have demonstrated a willingness to help out with the adminning of games, and my boy future is an uncle tom
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31/05/11 03:12pm
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Servers would either be run @ 500fps or 1000fps. Depending on which is the most stable. Most likely 500fps if we only have one box.
We are already looking at our options. Come Season 3, we will announce changes and possibly reach out to the community if it gets to that stage.
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31/05/11 03:12pm
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#38
They run at about 500-550 IDLE with spikes every few sec's
Under load they are about 200-380 with a spike every few sec's
This is unavoidable as the host "Hypernia" has problems at the DC.
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31/05/11 03:35pm
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was referring to your AUSSIEHQ box plans, x5 are looking for a reliable 500 or 1000fps server....
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31/05/11 03:37pm
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We can't offer any servers on the box unfortunately Sponny. Once you have 3-4 servers on a box, it is already getting crowded. Even a 1000fps server becomes unstable if there are 2 servers on a box...
Besides, x5 is sponsored by iiNet. You should be able to get something nice from them.
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31/05/11 03:54pm
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hmmm ok, we were running a zambee server for a month at a flat 1000fps, the issue was that the box had connection issues causing it to be unstable/spiky twice a week. But the server was so crisp when the connection was fine, actually felt like LAN would with 40 ping... We have a stipe server which hasn't been playable for the past 2 weeks, which I think they are fixing for us, was purely looking at options.
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31/05/11 04:35pm
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#37 well niggy I think the question is did he get jumped by all six of them chumps?
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31/05/11 05:59pm
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Just a suggestion from experience. The bot that i use for syd lan comps also has option to force povs, I use to force povs at lan but i noticed that by doing so, this created lag on the players pc so i removed it and the lag went away. This may be what is causing the lag for players.
The bop blocker should be removed.
I agree the bot makes life easier but making a drastic change right before finals was perhaps not the best idea. The bot should be refined and fixed up before being brought back. I happy to supply my bot that does all the things you mentioned only ive never had any issues with it (only tested at lan though). Everything amx is taken out of the bot and only thing running is the mods that admin the match.
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31/05/11 06:18pm
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#35 everything else isnt fine because the players still lag when the bot is active, its not just the bop stopper
Also the source league 'runs' without admins (they are still there in HLSW) but every time there is an issue its a frantic pm on steam friends to find an online admin to hopefully get it sorted while the game is live and its awful. We had to do something like that literally every single week while playing the CSS league due to server crashes, players dcing and needing (and not getting) pauses, server lag, relo3s, etc.
Like i said the bot probably shouldnt be relied upon as a necessity and should only be used if u desperately need it for some reason, if ur able to have an admin in the server (which by the looks of it people are willing to lend a hand to do) then its not really necessary.
It causes lag, and stuffs up movement with the bop remover. Its only 2 benefits are it 1. allows admins not to be present (which causes its own problems) and 2. auto-record povs (not necessary). So theres really no reason to have it imo.
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31/05/11 06:36pm
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Taking out the bop script and auto pov recorder atm
Dave its not just those 2 you listed.
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31/05/11 08:30pm
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Adjustments made, feels like an improvement 10 fold
see how it is under load tho.
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31/05/11 08:47pm
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Not sure why the bot would be re-introduced with 1 week remaining + finals.
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